String tree's. Why can't I use the Floyd thingy?

[NewStratLover]

Hey guys.. I am ordering a new neck today and I hate string trees. I thought about getting the wheel type, but I started to think, I've used a strat before or tried one that had a floyd rose and it had the two screws and metal bar that goes right between the nut and the truss rod access hole I think it is at the end of the neck and it gave the required downward pressure. Why not just use it? It would be much easier to install and I would think it wouldn't hang up as easily? Anyone?

 

[Quikstyl]

Hey guys.. I am ordering a new neck today and I hate string trees. I thought about getting the wheel type, but I started to think, I've used a strat before or tried one that had a floyd rose and it had the two screws and metal bar that goes right between the nut and the truss rod access hole I think it is at the end of the neck and it gave the required downward pressure. Why not just use it? It would be much easier to install and I would think it wouldn't hang up as easily? Anyone?

I suppose you could do it, just get the bar low enough to properly seat the strings in the nut. When I replaced the Kahler Spyder on my HM with a Floyd original back in '89, I left the Kahler locking nut on to avoid drilling the headstock for the Floyd locking nut, and never installed a string bar. I've never had any tuning issues using only the locking nut.

 

[revtime]

Staggered locking tuners. No trees and supa fast string changes.
No screwing a floyd bar into the neck either.

 

[Stephen James]

Hey guys.. I am ordering a new neck today and I hate string trees. I thought about getting the wheel type, but I started to think, I've used a strat before or tried one that had a floyd rose and it had the two screws and metal bar that goes right between the nut and the truss rod access hole I think it is at the end of the neck and it gave the required downward pressure. Why not just use it? It would be much easier to install and I would think it wouldn't hang up as easily? Anyone?

I have wondered this as well, but I think that it would probably wear out the nut quicker due to the bar increasing the friction on a softer material (bone, plastic, tusq, etc), as all the 'bar'-equipped necks I've ever played used some type of a steel nut..

 

[NewStratLover]

I have wondered this as well, but I think that it would probably wear out the nut quicker due to the bar increasing the friction on a softer material (bone, plastic, tusq, etc), as all the 'bar'-equipped necks I've ever played used some type of a steel nut..

I'm going to use a brass nut, but of course also one doesn't have to screw the bar down a lot. I even thought about screwing it down just on the treble side for the most part.

 

[TimJ]

Staggered locking tuners. No trees and supa fast string changes.
No screwing a floyd bar into the neck either.

+1 for this option, it’s what I use on all my Strats.

 

[Believer7713]

You can use the Floyd retainer bar easy enough. All you are trying to do is create enough down force to keep the strings in solidly the nut. You won't need to crank it down hard at all so there shouldn't be any more wear than string trees.
As recommended, staggered tuners work the best though.

 

[NewStratLover]

You can use the Floyd retainer bar easy enough. All you are trying to do is create enough down force to keep the strings in solidly the nut. You won't need to crank it down hard at all so there shouldn't be any more wear than string trees.
As recommended, staggered tuners work the best though.

Thanks man.. I kinda wanted to keep the original tuners because they are cool and gotohs.. Maybe not original, but gotohs!

 

[Butcher of Strats]

Without the locking nut locking the played audible portion of the strings, you are likely to get a ping where the big wound strings slide under the bar either when you tune or when you bend.
Not sure how a six string, string tree is an improvement on just a two string, string tree?

WRT staggered posts, note that they add almost no extra break angle to the B&E compared to non staggered tuners.
To get the break angle of the low strings or of he string tree with staggered posts, the high E and B tuners would need to be sunk below the top surface of the headstock.
Some players just dont care if the weak break angle attained withnstagger posts and no tree, changes the attack of the open high strings, because we never really play cowboy chords.

 

[Jasco]

Just go with no string trees or floyd bar tree thing. It'll stay in tune much better without them.

I've got over 20 strats. No string trees. No staggered tuners. They all sound fine on the open strings.

 

[Delphic]

I have a Fender MIM Richie Sambora Stratocaster with a (Fender factory-fitted) Floyd Rose.

It's not given me any problems, but when I look at the holes drilled in the headstock for the bar, and the cutaway for the locking nut, the headstock looks scarily fragile.

I'm not sure why you think fitting one would be easier than fitting string trees. The bar needs some biggish holes to be drilled right through the headstock.

I would go with staggered tuners if possible.

 

[Phrankenstrat]

As others have stated, staggered locking tuners FTW.

 

[stratgeek]

Hey guys.. I am ordering a new neck today and I hate string trees. I thought about getting the wheel type, but I started to think, I've used a strat before or tried one that had a floyd rose and it had the two screws and metal bar that goes right between the nut and the truss rod access hole I think it is at the end of the neck and it gave the required downward pressure. Why not just use it? It would be much easier to install and I would think it wouldn't hang up as easily? Anyone?

I installed staggered tuners on mine, but the two high strings still needed a tighter bend to keep from pulling out of the nut slots. So I chose the Graphtek TUSQ tree in black. It works great and I think it’s a great look. Plus, it is about as frictionless as you can get.

 

[Eric Dahlberg]

Without the locking nut locking the played audible portion of the strings, you are likely to get a ping where the big wound strings slide under the bar either when you tune or when you bend.
Not sure how a six string, string tree is an improvement on just a two string, string tree?

WRT staggered posts, note that they add almost no extra break angle to the B&E compared to non staggered tuners.
To get the break angle of the low strings or of he string tree with staggered posts, the high E and B tuners would need to be sunk below the top surface of the headstock.
Some players just dont care if the weak break angle attained withnstagger posts and no tree, changes the attack of the open high strings, because we never really play cowboy chords.

I installed the Floyd retainer bar before. Looked ugly and constantly went out of tune. Really one of the stupidest mods I’ve ever done.

Agreed on staggered tuners. Staggered’s with a string tree seems to stay in tune better than normals with a string tree but that might be confirmation bias on my part. My Strat with staggered tuners, LSR nut, and 2-point trem still goes out of tune if I use the string tree (almost perfect tuning without the tree).

 

[Butcher of Strats]

Just go with no string trees or floyd bar tree thing. It'll stay in tune much better without them.

I've got over 20 strats. No string trees. No staggered tuners. They all sound fine on the open strings.

So many variables when we are all tuning up/ playing listening and hearing/ working on our own guitars/ shopping and blogging about this part vs that part.

One major variable is when a hobbyist installs new parts then critiques the parts, the install quality may effect the outcome.

Another huge variable is when we say it "works great".
I notice for example that some players have a problem with three saddle Tele bridges because they hear a problem.
I do not hear the problem that they hear.
Some even hear a problem with intonation that they resort to a compensated nut and/ or tempered tuning.

My use of the single string tree is not because I currently have a problem with the firmness of the attack on loose break angles at the nut, I just always have and do not have any problems caused by the strung tree.

But I believe some players, in particular fingerstyle chord melody players, who primarily play slow sustaining finger picked chord melody where they hear each strings attack against the others (over and overnthrough entire pieces of music); I belive them when they compare high E/B/G under the tree to high E/B/G pulled out from under the tree, and feel they attack or some other thing is diminished by the weak break angle of no tree.

Some players now go to the triple tree to include the G, and I cannot say they are wrong!

I do prefer a stronger break angle at the bridge, and hear a weak break angle as a weaker response.
Never need to fiddle with that problem at the nut because I do not choose to fix the single tree which seems to work fine for me.
I would be surprised to find a string tree causes tuning problems, though of course with a trem it is one more point of friction.
The bigger double roller nut Beck favored seems better than the lightly resting high strings over the single roller, but again, if we find something that works for us, that is the right solution for us!

 

[OneOcean]

Staggered locking tuners. No trees and supa fast string changes.
No screwing a floyd bar into the neck either.

Staggered tuners hardly make any difference to the string break angle over the nut, certainly not enough to eliminate the need for string trees or similar device. I have two Fenders with staggered tuners and they both have decreased plain string sustain and ringing above the nut. Shortening the top of a tuner post does not change where the string exits the bottom of the post. Best you can do is have as many string windings as possible to get the string to exit the post as low to the headstock as possible and this still does not provide adequate angle over nut. Staggered tuners are a gimmick and I feel stupid for not thinking about it a little bit before trying them.

 

[OneOcean]

Hey guys.. I am ordering a new neck today and I hate string trees. I thought about getting the wheel type, but I started to think, I've used a strat before or tried one that had a floyd rose and it had the two screws and metal bar that goes right between the nut and the truss rod access hole I think it is at the end of the neck and it gave the required downward pressure. Why not just use it? It would be much easier to install and I would think it wouldn't hang up as easily? Anyone?

Check out the Reverend Triple Tree. It mounts with a single screw and holds down the three plain strings under a polished round bar. You can mount it where a typical Fender tree would go so someone could revert back to traditional Fender if wanted. I'm thinking of trying them on a couple of my Fenders that currently have useless staggered tuners.

 

[Willmunny]

I don't think I have seen anyone mention paying attention to the back side of the nut, making sure it is shaped properly, will go a long way to tuning stability.
Obviously this statement doesn't go towards a genuine locking nut

 

[Eric Dahlberg]

Best you can do is have as many string windings as possible to get the string to exit the post as low to the headstock as possible and this still does not provide adequate angle over nut. Staggered tuners are a gimmick and I feel stupid for not thinking about it a little bit before trying them.

Locking tuners. But yes, staggered non-locking tuners are probably a useless gimmick. I always wrapped ends of my plain strings around and under the first wind to create a lock but that never worked as well as locking tuners, anyway.

Check out the Reverend Triple Tree. It mounts with a single screw and holds down the three plain strings under a polished round bar. You can mount it where a typical Fender tree would go so someone could revert back to traditional Fender if wanted. I'm thinking of trying them on a couple of my Fenders that currently have useless staggered tuners.

What does this solve? Does the G-string sound better with a sharper break angle?

 

[Slacker G]

I tried a Rose and I did not like it at all.

With my first experience with a Floyd nut I forgot to loosen the nut screws and I snapped the high "E" before I realized what I did.

I never like Floyd vibrato either. It was a pain for me to get in tune.

If the nut is cut properly, and you wind your high strings almost to the bottom of the peg, you don't need string trees either on a Strat.