How High is Too High For an SG Tail Piece?
- Thread starter Guithartic
- Start date
StratoMutt
Dr. Stratster
A neck reset, commonly done on acoustic guitars after many years.
I’m talking about the break angle behind the bridge. on any bolt on neck you can shim it to achieve the necessary break angle.
On a Strat or other fender this is done with shims in the neck pocket.
On the Gibsons we are talking about the bridge break angle is adjusted at the stop tailpiece.
ThreeChordWonder
Senior Stratmaster
^ Ahh...
Not all of them. The Leo Quan BasAss bridge is certainly one solution to the one piece wrap around Gibson bridge. I like the Wilkinson version better though.
Yeah, nothing is perfect.
The break angle in my photos is perfect. The collapsing bridge is another problem which can be fixed in a vise.
How does shimming the neck change the break angle, when the break angle is from the top of the saddle to the entry point of the tremolo block?
Shimming the neck requires a change in the saddle height, but that minimally impacts the break angle, which is around 50-60 degrees on a Fender. Intonation has more of an impact on the break angle by moving the saddle closer or further from the hole in the bridge plate.
It is. Either way, the change wasn't dramatic.
Top-wrap, string-through, touching the bridge, not touching the bridge, mustard, ketchup...nobody can hear the difference. The internet says top-wrapping will make the strings feel "slinkier", that hasn't been my experience to any appreciable degree.
Also, the one piece bridge isn’t what we are actually discussing. Even though it looks similar it’s not.
Back in the late 70’s BC Rich made some high end expensive guitars that all used the Leo Quan bridge and I could never get my head around the fact that the most expensive boutique guitar on the market had the cheapest bridge design on it. They were over $2k in 1978 money which would make it a $10k guitar in today‘s money yet used a Les Paul jr replacement bridge. It never made sense to me and because of that one thing I never thought those BC Rich’s were that great.
dirocyn
Most Honored Senior Member
The break angle is not the neck angle, it's the angle the strings break over the bridge (and also at the nut). Just raise the stop bar.
I realize that, but any SG could be converted to a one piece. And it won't hurt resale value at all.
On a fender if the saddle is too low where the height adj screws stick up too high or the saddle sits on the bridge plate, which happens sometimes especially on the basses then shimming the neck back will give you the break angle needed. If the bridge is set too high where the saddles are jacked way up then you need to shim the north side of the neck pocket to reduce it. We may be conflating what we are discussing when it comes to the break angle on a fender, because this discussion was really about the Gibson Tuneamatic with a Stop TP.
if you want to really understand how break angle works then take a Strat or Tele and remove the two high strings from under the string tree then retune and play it, then put them back under the string tree and notice how much different it plays or sounds.
I get it about the saddle height, but the height of the saddle has minimal impact on the break angle, since that is relatively fixed. Moving the saddle back for intonation has a greater impact on the saddle break angle, but in no event is the Fender saddle break angle anywhere near as shallow as even an improperly set up Gibson.
Fender break angle is effectively as fixed as an acoustic... and the acoustic break angle is closer to a typical Gibson.
StratUp
Most Honored Senior Member
If you have a vintage LP, be aware that top wrapping will lead to some wear to the finish on the tailpiece where the strings rest.
StratUp
Most Honored Senior Member
Yeah... I went through some issues on one troublesome guitar with a tailpiece/stop bar when fitting an intonatable tailpiece.
The badass style is a lot taller. That was an issue for me vis-a-vis the neck angle. The Wilkinson is significantly shorter. That style would be my choice every time.
AngelDeVille
Senior Stratmaster
I top wrap cuz it looks cool.
My PRS SE Paul's guitar was virtually perfect out of the box. Fret ends too.
Guithartic
Senior Stratmaster
I’m fine with it now. I loosened the strings to see how high the stop bar could go before the screws came out. You can actually raise it until the stop bar is just above the saddles. So in that respect the height I have is safe. I took it to a luthier, and he said it looks normal for an SG and showed me an actual ‘61 walnut SG, and the stop bar was about the same.
(Edit after feedback: mahogany, not walnut.)
Another update is that yesterday, I found a 2021 SG Standard selling locally for $900 in perfect condition with no case. I bought it and set it up, and the stopbar height is identical, helping to confirm the normalcy of it. It gives peace of mind that neither guitar is faulty. The new plan is to get new strings and try top wrapping this week. Can’t wait to see the difference.
(Edit after feedback: mahogany, not walnut.)
Another update is that yesterday, I found a 2021 SG Standard selling locally for $900 in perfect condition with no case. I bought it and set it up, and the stopbar height is identical, helping to confirm the normalcy of it. It gives peace of mind that neither guitar is faulty. The new plan is to get new strings and try top wrapping this week. Can’t wait to see the difference.
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